12. Robin Singh ~ Sandler Mississauga
Episode Notes
Key moments from this episode
Robin Singh joins Tailwind for a tactical conversation about no-pressure prospecting: why standard elevator pitches create resistance, how permission and pattern interrupts lower the pressure on cold calls, how emotional pain points shape a useful 30-second commercial, how sellers can read and adjust to DISC-style communication cues, and why getting to no helps clear the way to find real yeses.
Takeaways
- Traditional elevator pitches can trigger resistance because prospects immediately hear a sales pitch and put their guard up.
- Permission, transparency, and a pattern interrupt make a cold call feel lower-pressure for both sides.
- A strong 30-second commercial names emotional business problems and asks which one resonates instead of asking a yes-or-no question.
- Sellers can improve early conversations by understanding their own communication style and listening for the prospect's DISC-style cues.
- Getting to no is useful because it clears non-fits and helps sellers focus on the real yeses underneath the rejection.
Key Moments
- 0:10
Why cold calls need a different opening
Robin explains how he had to learn prospecting after joining Sandler and why typical elevator pitches trigger resistance.
- 1:49
Permission lowers the pressure
Robin demonstrates a no-pressure opening that names the cold call, asks for 45 seconds, and lets the prospect decide whether to continue.
- 3:16
Pain points inside the commercial
The conversation moves into emotional pain points, from reps not prospecting to stalled funnels and discounting.
- 5:15
Respecting the upfront contract
Austin points out how Robin uses the original 45-second agreement to avoid over-talking and move toward a deeper meeting.
- 6:16
Pattern interrupts and cold call structure
Robin breaks down the pieces sellers can adjust while keeping the bones of a transparent, no-pressure prospecting structure.
- 10:10
Reading DISC style early
Robin shares how small responses such as a pause, a chuckle, or a direct question can help sellers adjust to the prospect's style.
- 15:32
Practicing with AI roleplay
Robin describes using an AI roleplay coach to practice calls against different DISC-style prospects before making real calls.
- 19:57
Why no is a good thing
Robin closes by reframing no as useful because it clears the wrong opportunities and helps sellers find the yeses.
Transcript
0:03 Go. Okay. All right. Okay. >> All right. So, as you were saying, what's the difference?
0:10 >> So, hang. Yeah. So, for me, you know what I like and believe it or not, I mean, I've been I've been in sales for many, many, many years. Okay. Uh, and I
0:20 just told a story recently that that when I joined Sandler, I didn't know how to prospect. I didn't I I didn't know how to co- call because I never did them
0:27 in my life. Okay. and and so I had to make cold calls.
0:31 And as I listen to, you know, non-Sandler folks, uh, and and and why why would a prospect pick the phone up
0:40 or why would a prospect carry a conversation on >> u when when you hear, you know, two various types of prospecting pitches, as
0:50 I call them, okay? >> And I'll give you the examples of what I think it is. First off, if you think about the non- Sandler trained person, he picks up the phone, he dials in, the
1:00 prospect answers the phone, and he gets into what I call his 30 second or his elevator pitch. There's no pauses.
1:06 There's no nothing. Right away, the prospect knows that this is a sales call.
1:12 >> And his immediate reaction is going to be, I'm good. We're okay. Got no problems.
1:17 >> Yeah. >> Right. Typically. Okay. Um, and and that could sound something like, you know, uh, hey Austin, as Robin saying, I'm with Sander Training. We're a global
1:25 organization. We work with companies like yourself who provide sales training, leadership, and management development. And by that time, you're going, here comes the sales guy.
1:32 >> I'm already overwhelmed. >> Right. We hear that. I mean, right.
1:38 Okay. And and the same methodology which which I found to work uh really well is is is you know when we make that call we sound and act different you know and
1:49 it's something like you know hey Austin is Robin saying with Sander >> hey Robin how you did >> typical answer right typical answer no
2:02 kidding then it goes like you you know Austin hey man look I want to be honest with you this is a cold call you can hang up now or give me 45 seconds. Tell
2:11 you the purpose of my call and you decide whether we continue or not. Is that okay?
2:17 >> Let's have that 45 seconds. Yeah. >> 99% of the time and I've been doing this for 10 years. 99% of the time I'm going to get the same answer that you just
2:26 gave me. >> Okay. You got 45 seconds or you got 30 seconds or whatever it is. Okay. Then I go into my pitch. Okay. Hey, um you know
2:36 how with Sandler? I'm curious. Ever heard of Sandler?
2:40 I have. >> Yeah, there you go. So now there's there's room for conversation.
2:46 Austin, interesting. Hey man, where have you heard about us?
2:50 >> Well, you used to work for one of your competitors. >> So we always talked about you guys because you were people always like, "Hey, they're going to beat us on this one."
2:59 >> So there's the comp there's the conversation now. See how it's different, >> right? And I go, "You know what? That's Yeah, I I hear you. That's true."
3:07 Sometimes they go, "No, I go that's okay. We're a global organization and you know, Austin, when I work with executives or speak to, you know, executives like yourselves and you know,
3:16 they tell me they've got a good sales team, but at times they're frustrated because the guys aren't prospecting enough >> and it's affecting, you know, it's
3:24 affecting revenue growth." Yeah. Second thing I hear is that they're disappointed because there's a lot of stuff in the funnel. Nothing is closing.
3:33 >> And the third thing I hear a lot of is that they're angry.
3:37 Because when they do close business, guess what? They've got to discount it.
3:41 And this affects bonuses and profitability. Look, Austin, I don't know your business that well, but I'm curious which of these resonate with you.
3:52 >> That's great. >> Look at the the permission structure of it.
3:56 >> Yeah. Right. And that's the key difference in, you know, in prospecting.
4:02 the key difference between what Sandler does or how we train our folks and what I use personally. Okay. Because if I teach it, I've got to use it. Okay. Um,
4:12 and and as you can see from there, like you said, the permission piece, uh, the tone, right, where I where I use the
4:21 emotional words, frustrated, angry, disappointed, and then I then I touched on, you know, in my world, three pain
4:30 points that we hear a lot of, right? Guy's not prospecting, lots of stuff in a funnel, nothing is closing or discounting, right? So, so you know in
4:40 in somebody else's world, what are the what are the issues that we solve? If you can highlight those issues as part of your 30 secondond commercial, okay,
4:49 then there's resonation from a prospect perspective because if you think about what I said at the end was like, you know, hey, which of these
5:00 resonate with you? I didn't say does any. So that's a yes, no answer, >> right? which of these and I might get I one two or three right and if that's the
5:09 case then it's further the conversation yeah let's assume you had said to me you said Robin yeah man one one resonates a lot with me I can do one or two things I
5:19 could say you know Austin you were kind enough to give me 45 seconds what time's up do you want to continue on or should we schedule some time together to do a
5:28 deep dive what the issues are there's my appointment >> there's my appointment there.
5:34 >> I really like that move right there with the uh hey, you set that up front contract. You said hey, you're going to give me 45 sec. If you're giving me 45
5:43 seconds, I'm going to respect that. and then >> using that to then switch it over and not try to boil the ocean during that initial cold call and just be like,
5:52 "Let's get over to this meeting instead of just kind of get stuck in this cold call for too long and maybe like talk it through and end up losing the interest
6:01 because it's the wrong setting to have the conversation." >> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. when it comes to that structure, you know, uh what are the parts for certain people where you'd
6:10 say like feel free to like adjust these parts but keep these bones in place at all times.
6:16 >> Yeah, I think it's important. So for me, I like I like being upfront radical, right? That that's the key differentiator. This is a cold call.
6:24 >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I mean, they didn't heard that. So So you can change that depending on who you're calling on. So, if I'm calling on a CEO of a company, I don't want to say,
6:35 "Hey, this is a business call, >> right? If I'm calling on a VP of sales, this is a cold call. They like to hear
6:43 this stuff." Okay? So, that's a key two key differentiators that I uh that I use in my in my pitches. Okay? And if you notice, I didn't say, "Hey, can I have
6:55 30 to 45 seconds?" I said subtly I'm going to take 30 to 45 seconds >> tell you the purpose of my call there's another subtlety in it okay because if I
7:06 say hey can I take it the the answer is yes no >> okay >> but the way I framed it subtly right in the tone says I'm going to take uh and
7:17 at the end you decide whether we continue or not right there's a another key differentiator right >> and then I I like the piece where it
7:26 says hey ever heard of us because there's o there's room for open conversation, right? Which is what it's all about. It's all about having that conversation uh between between two
7:37 folks, right? And that makes that 30 second commercial, as I call them, there's less pressure in in in both people, right? So, you know, it's a no
7:47 pressure. We call them a no pressure prospecting call, right? >> Yeah. where it's that conversation, the pressure is off. You know, once you hear, hey, this is a cold call, this
7:55 business call, right? >> Kind of the barriers get lowered right away to an extent >> because if I did what I did at the beginning, man, your barriers go up
8:05 right away. And you go, here comes a here comes a sales guy. Boom. My barriers go up, >> you know. So, that's that helps to lower the barrier once we change some of these
8:15 things. And then and then the last part of it which I think is important well two parts here is you know if you think about it the pain issues that I spoke
8:24 about not prospecting um things are not closing discounting those are what I call emotional issues
8:34 that executives will have >> and when you think about emotional issues if you heard me if you heard me I used emotional words to emphasize the
8:45 emotional issues Okay. Frustrated, angry, disappointed.
8:50 Okay. I mean, you hear them every time. You hear them in people. I'm frustrated with the Toronto Maple Leafs. I'm disappointed with the Blue Jays.
8:58 >> Yeah. >> Emotional words, right? So, we use the same emotional words to highlight the issues that companies are facing. And
9:07 then what I call is the is the you know at the back end of it all is is the hook the hook question the hook statement hook question right which of these
9:17 resonate right >> so there you go I don't know if that answered that question >> it totally did yeah yeah yeah >> so within that I mean do you have a
9:27 strong belief and like um you know you you start with the hey this is a business caller this is a cold call you know what I've been doing has been like
9:35 I might say something like um hey did I catch you in the middle of something or do you have a minute to talk about and then whatever is going to be the thing I
9:44 think is resonant to their position. >> So I might be like growing your book business or talking about prospecting or you know so on and so forth.
9:52 >> Um you know do you think uh there's like a specific set of like ways like phrase that opening part or is it just kind of like find what's interesting and what
10:00 resonates with yourself? >> Yeah. Yeah, that works also. Um but again it's it's for me again this is personally for me and how I coach my
10:10 guys okay and what works in my world okay uh I want to be different again >> I want to sound different right and so when I come in with hey this is Robin
10:19 with Sander and I pause I mean there's a couple things happening right away you're going like Robin who is Robin do I know him hey Robin how could I help
10:26 you right uh so there's a difference and we call that a pattern interrupt okay so so so there's a difference and then you know how can I help typically it's yeah
10:37 how are you how can I help okay what's this about okay >> uh these are three things and and that that kind of tells me you know who's calling that the dis profile of somebody
10:48 >> because if they're pondering too long that could be a high C if it's a what's this about that's a high D okay and I and I know how to react and and change
10:58 accordingly >> yeah wow >> so Right I never thought to try to figure out with that somebody's disc profile within the first 10 seconds of
11:07 talking to them. Um, do you find that it's like really accurate or just like enough accurate to at least be able to get through like the next, you know,
11:14 minute and a half, two minutes of the conversation? >> Yeah. So, uh, when I hear when I hear, uh, what's this about?
11:25 >> Right away, I know there's a high D. >> Yeah. >> Right. Right away. Yeah.
11:29 >> And I got to be very, very specific in it. Right. >> Um when I hear when I hear, you know, hey, hey, Austin, this is a co
11:40 call, uh I can hear a chuckle. >> Yeah. >> U and a little giggle, right? Or a little laugh, right? And I go, there's a
11:50 high eye. He's a friendly type of guy. High eye. High C.
11:54 When I hear a pause, that pause tells me this guy can be a high C where he's thinking. He's very detail oriented. Who's this guy? Where
12:04 do I know him from? How long do I know? Who's it? Then I know that's a high C.
12:09 Okay. So, I kind of use those little little pauses quickly to determine the type of person I'm dealing with. And that that really helps lend the
12:18 conversation. >> Yeah. To where we're going. Right. >> What about the >> high D? Yeah. High D. By the way, because I tend to say, "Hey, I'm going to take I'm going to take 45 seconds to
12:27 a minute." >> Mhm. >> The high D will say, "You got 30 seconds."
12:32 >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Have you ever had a countdown start? I've had something that go 30 29.
12:39 >> Yeah. Right. So, what I do, I just shorten them my my pain funnel.
12:45 >> Instead of giving three, I just give two. >> Okay.
12:49 >> Uh and I pick the two most important things, right? One is discounting and one is not prospecting. Okay. Those are the two things that we hear a lot of. So
12:56 I've shortened that pretty quickly. Okay. Um and then go from there. Right.
13:01 >> Yeah. So for for somebody who's thinking or hearing this and thinking how do I apply this and maybe that maybe I'm just talking about for me. I mean that's such
13:09 an interesting thing is like I'm not I haven't been thinking how do I try to get that piece of information at the start and then adjust.
13:17 How would you recommend somebody taking on that practice for themselves? Because obviously, you know, if you can start, you know, leaning into somebody's DISC
13:23 profile uh during that, you're going to have more success with, you know, your 30 secondond commercial or just getting that first meeting. Uh how would you
13:30 recommend somebody taking on that practice for themselves? >> It's a good question. I think first off, you've got to know what is your disc style.
13:37 >> What is your communication style? Okay. Once you understand your communication style uh and then you're able to sense what the other person's communication
13:46 style is and from that from that perspective you adjust accordingly. But if you don't know your communication style, it first it's going to be difficult to figure out when to adjust
13:56 or how to adjust, you know. So, as an example, right, let's assume that, you know, I don't know my style, but I'm a high eye. A high I is the kind of person
14:05 would like to say, hey, how's your day? How's the weather? Did you see the Blue Jays game? A high D is going to go pick up whatever it is, what is it? Get
14:14 to the point, right? >> U so you got to understand what your style is. Okay, that's the first thing.
14:20 Like once you understand your style then you've got to you know you really got to spend some time to understand how to read somebody else's disc style. Okay.
14:29 And if you can do that then it becomes a lot easier. Okay. uh because now you could hear certain things uh that's transpiring and the language will tell
14:39 you what it is because each of the communication styles I mean there there are different languages and tonalities that will tell you who I'm dealing with
14:49 and how I should change or react accordingly. Okay.
14:52 >> Um so I think I think to answer the question you got to know what your style is first.
14:57 >> Yeah. Once you understand what your style is, right, then you're able to understand what the other person's style is and adjust accordingly.
15:04 >> Yeah, >> that make sense. >> Yeah. And then is it just uh I mean, should you sit down with like AI and just like tell AI to be like, "Hey, be a D. I'm going to practice this." Or
15:13 should you just get the reps in and then after each time you you call a prospect, >> sit down there and be like, "Okay, I think what I messed up was they did a D
15:22 profile. I didn't shorten up. I'm gonna try again next time." and just say hey roll with the punches >> which leads to another
15:32 I'm glad you brought it up. Okay, which leads to another uh service that we launched about a year ago. Okay, >> which which lends to exactly what you're
15:42 saying. >> Yeah. >> Uh we just launched a Sandler AI roleplay coach.
15:47 >> Yeah. >> Okay. and the AI roleplay coach can act as one of the various different disc styles that I'm dealing with.
15:56 >> So, if I want to practice uh calling on a high D, okay, I can go into my roleplay coach, activate that AI agent
16:06 who acts as a high D >> and practice with that high D.
16:11 >> Yeah. >> Okay. So that I know uh I'm getting straight to it, etc. And then and then the results will tell me here's what you need to do, here's what you did
16:20 differently, here's what you need to work on. So now I can go back in, pull up that AI uh role like the AI agent who is a high D and practice again with
16:29 them. Okay. >> Yeah. >> So that's one way of doing it and and we just launched that about a year ago. So um that's what I use. Okay.
16:37 >> Yeah. Makes sense. >> Yeah. Right. So, so you get the the first line in, you you hit them with like the question, you figure out if they're your disc profile, you do your
16:47 best sleuththing, and then, you know, you said that you mentioned, have you heard of, you know, Sandler before? Um, you know, then you have your three pills
16:55 that you're going to hit them with. Do you ever drop those if they like already have like a, you know, oh yeah, you know, I've worked with Sandler in the
17:01 past, you guys are great, blah, blah, blah. Do you still go into that or do you do you have like >> pivots that you make throughout the process?
17:08 >> Right. If you if if they say to me, "Hey, yes, I heard of Sandler." My next question is going to be, "Tell me more."
17:16 >> Wow. We work with Andrew Wall uh in you know, Milton. You know what? That's that's awesome. Andrew is a great trainer. Why don't we end the conversation here? I want you to
17:25 continue working with Andrew because I love Andrew. He's my buddy. >> Um and and and keep keep going. Keep going. Okay. So, I end the conversation
17:34 there. And that's the agreement we have with with our franchises and my colleagues is that we respect each other.
17:42 I know. Yeah. That's where we go. >> Yeah. So, so it would be like a if you think they don't have enough information about Sandler, then you would go, okay,
17:52 here's I'm going to tell you the reasons you would engage with us >> if they seem like they have all the information. And then is there a middle ground or is it pretty easy to just be
18:00 like it's really one or two paths when you're talking to them? Uh when you say middle ground, give me give. Yeah.
18:06 >> Like something where it's like, you know, you know, hey, we work with Andrew, you know, okay, cool. You should keep working with, you know, Andrew. Uh
18:13 versus like, hey, you you've heard of us. Um Okay, cool. And then maybe like play off of what they've heard about you and then go that direction instead of
18:20 going to your three points or like, you know, how does that, you know, work in >> your >> Yeah. So the middle ground would be the qu the, you know, hey, tell me more
18:28 about it. You know, how'd you hear about us? What did you heard? Right. Mhm. >> And sometimes it's going to be well yeah we saw you guys on LinkedIn or we saw uh
18:35 we saw something of this nature or we read a white paper we downloaded a white paper some or I attended a seminar and we have these online seminars. So I'll
18:44 get some of those. Okay. And if I get any of those I'll go hey you know tell me more. I just want to make sure I understand where I'm going >> before I get into my my pain issues.
18:54 Okay. Uh again that conversation that I'm having right now again on the this side of it. Okay, believe it
19:04 or not, a high D is not going to tell me a whole bunch of stuff. Okay, the high I's and the S's will tell me more.
19:12 >> U and and I'll let them chat a little bit more. I let them converse because that's building that rapport. That that's important to build that trust.
19:21 Then I would say, "Hey, hey, let me tell you what we do. Let me tell you how we solve these issues, okay? And then I will get into that. But depending on the
19:28 disc style of the person that I'm dealing with. >> Yeah. Awesome. Well, hey, I know that we talked at the top of the conversation that you had a a heart out coming up
19:38 right now, so I want to respect that. >> Um, I love this approach to figuring out the disc early on. It had never occurred to me to try to do that. Now I need to
19:47 go practice a bunch. Um any any final uh you know summarization or thoughts that you want to you know sum everything up that we had just talked about on
19:57 >> you know uh so so from a prospecting perspective what I've learned over the years is that no is a good thing.
20:06 >> Yeah. And and when I started I did not I I hate prospecting. I still hate it. Okay.
20:16 But I've learned to go, you know, I've learned to accept that nos are a good thing because that allows me to kind of wipe the slate of those, put that park
20:24 them aside and look for the yeses. >> And in all the nos that that I will get, I can tell you beneath those nos, there's one or two yeses. And those are
20:34 my keys that I go after. Right. I'll leave it with that.
20:38 >> That's a perfect way to sum it all up. Thank you so much, Robin. I really appreciate the time on this.
20:43 >> Take care, Austin. Pleasure.